efx send/return vs. straight in...

[pbarden]

I've got a Peavey Delta Blues 210 (a great-sounding amp). It's got an effects loop on it. Anyway when I use my wah (a Vox) or MXR Super Comp in the efx loop, the tone... well, basically sucks. The wah creates an ear-piercing treble tone, and the compressor doesn't do anything. When I go guirar -> effects -> amp, the tone sounds 1000 percent better. I'm just curious as to why... Are some pedals just not meant for the efx loop? Maybe my efx send/return is faulty... Any insights would be appreciated!

[fullcity]

When nothing is plugged into your FX loop, the guitar amp's preamp section has a direct internal connection to the power amplifier section.

The FX loop is meant to provide you with a "patch" point between that connection. The Send is a patch from the preamp output, and the Return is a patch into the power amp input.

The reason your wah sounds crappy there is because the wah's input jack is intended to accept a low level guitar or instrument signal. The preamp output from your FX send is a line level signal, which in addition is made louder by the gain controls on your amp. It will appear to the wah as a blast of distortion because its output level is much higher than the wah expects.

Certain types of effects are indeed intended to accept either a line level signal only, an instrument signal only, or an instrument OR line level signal (with electronic buffering when it detects the louder line signal). In general, distortions, overdrives, compressors, and wahs are used before the preamp - these go before the amp's front end. Chorus, delay, flangers, and other modulation effects can go either at the front end or in the FX loop. Again, these are generalizations - but I think that explains the problem that you are experiencing.

Regards,
Roger

[English bob]

so i have a boss delay/reverb pedal an ibanez flanger and prco rat2. do i put the rat through the loop like the rest or not? also i was told (but dont know if true) that the sequence of pedals should go delay>phase/flangeretc>distortion. is this true?

[daveyboy]

No dude, I would keep the rat in front of the preamp.

[Greyskull]

Back in the golden days of tone all of the signal processing was done before it hit the amp.

I think effects loops are bogus, and prefer the "old fashioned" method....

[stratocaster83]

dist., od., comp., wha go in the front. delay, reverb, harmony/octave in the loop. chorus, tremolo, phaser, vibrato, LFO effects in general are put where they sound best!

personally I like the phaser in the front; chorus and tremolo in the loop of my plexi.

you must consider this: if you use a distortion pedal on an amp set clean, you may consider to put everything that was in the loop directly behind the distortion/od/wah pedals, because effects on the clean sound won't be that different, especially on mosFET or transitor amps.

but we also have to consider that too much effects can ruin the sound of the guitar, unless you have a VHT valvulator or something that keeps the resistence high!!!

and also: the amp has a series or parallels loop?

greyskull said he prefers to keep everything in the front: I agree with him coz' I read what he plays, and it does make sense to him... but maybe you need more discrete and clean reverbs and delay (think about modern/nineties sound), and the best way to obtain it is to use the loop...

anyway: pedals are the worst subeject in guitarist school!!! try every solution, and trust only your hear!!! I think this should be rule #1 for every musician...