tweaked PDS 20/20 [Archive]

fiveways

12.09.03, 5:08 PM

I have just gotten 20 seconds of delay/hold with this monster. Low Res delay/looping joy!

There are 3 trim pots inside, pretty easy to do, and unlike the RDS series, it can be done with a battery to measure as you are tweaking it.

Thanks to Effector 13 for the info.

zepolant

12.09.03, 5:36 PM

Egadds man! That's massive delay! Nice, very nice.

BmoreTele

12.28.03, 10:36 AM

I just got a tweaked 20/20 too. Excellent! I set up a loop in Echo mode with the speed and wdith at zero and then twiddle with the controls for cyclic runaway pitch oscillation. Cool.

duluxdog

01.05.04, 5:18 PM

Hmm, i'm trying to track one of these down in the UK. I like the idea behind this..

duluxdog

01.05.04, 5:21 PM

ahh nats, I might just find a US eBayer willing to ship to the UK.

The problem with UK eBay is that a PDS 20/20 will eventually come up but it will go for quite a lot because they are rare here.

any

05.18.04, 2:53 AM

Well, my 20/20 arrived yesterday... (the 'broken' one I bought for 20 euro's)
First of all it looks f*ckin brand new!
Now for all you non-believers I have made a picture (http://www.anyplace.nl/pics/2020.jpg) to show how nice it looks... :D
But it's broken... right?
So I power up the pedal and the switches all work, LED's blink, just no delayed sound...

Here's what the 20/20's f8ckin manual says under troubleshooting:

In the unlikely event that you experience difficulty with the PDS 20/20, please check the battery. Digital signal processors in general draw more battery current and have a shorter battery life than analog processors. A low battery may cause any of the following symptoms: failure of the unit to switch on or off, excessive distortion (clipping) or failure of the unit to produce a wet signal regardless of the state of the LEDs. In most cases the unit can be restored to proper operation by replacing the battery or by using any A.C. adapter.

So I check the 'fresh' battery that he send along with it... hmmm.... mayebe try an adapter to be sure?

:D

I bet this guy just wished he tried it with a good quality 'duracell' or an adapter before he sold it as 'broken'...
Really, does it get any dumber than that? Anyway, I'm going to tweak the pots tonight!
(yes I found the thread with the right info and I'll mark the factory settings first)

PS: Fiveways, thanks for saying "I'd take the risk" in that other thread...
This turned out to be as good if not better then my 40 euro DM-2.

PS: Deluxdog, I'm sorry if I'm making you (or anyone else) jealous or mad with this story... It was just too good to be true.

any

05.18.04, 12:01 PM

I modded it for 5 sec. and self oscillation :D

GOOD!

(sweetest 20 bucks ever!)

hot_rats!

05.18.04, 4:09 PM

very nice find. ima start looking at more "broken" pedals from now on.

Talon

05.18.04, 4:32 PM

whats the primary difference between the pds and the dd-20? i would assume that the dd-20 is more hi fi?

doingtheunstuck

05.18.04, 5:18 PM

Originally posted by Talon
whats the primary difference between the pds and the dd-20? i would assume that the dd-20 is more hi fi?

the primary difference? they're entirely different pedals. they're both delays and they can both do holds, but the sound, feel, and such of the two are incredibly different.

any

05.19.04, 1:41 AM

After one long night of playing I can be sure to say this is one sweet pedal!
I really like how the bypass/repeat switches work, great for live use and layering parts!

It's also the first pedal I've found that doesn't mute the stereo (right) output in bypass so you can actually use it as a signal "Y" splitter!
Now I could run my phasers, flangers and delays in stereo in parallel, run them through my stereo panning pedal into my DL-4.... that would be so sick! I'll definatly try to post clips of that once I'll hook it up... (I'll need to find a way to Mic it in stereo though)

Just imagine the signal path... :D :

PDS 20/20 Left out: -> Yamaha FL-01 Flanger (1st)-> Boss DM-2 delay -> Boss PH-1r phaser ->Boss PN-2 tremelo/pan -> Line6 DL-4 Left in-> AMP 1

PDS 20/20 Right out: -> Yamaha FL-01 Flanger (2nd) -> Ibanez AD-9 delay -> EH Small Stone phaser -> Boss PN-2 tremelo/pan -> Line6 DL-4 Right in-> AMP 2

cursivescript

05.20.04, 6:50 AM

i modded mine for 12 secs and Near self-osc.

fiveways

05.20.04, 8:44 AM

Originally posted by cursivescript
i modded mine for 12 secs and Near self-osc.

Have you tried messing with your Ibanez delays before(trimpot wise)? And what is your rig now.....

You've always had pretty interesting taste in stuff....

cursivescript

05.20.04, 6:45 PM

which one, the DE7? i'm scared to open up the older ones. my rig... well, i'm not in a band and i rarely play outside of the house so i just change things all the time, but my inventory is:

Guitars:
Fender(s) Jazzmaster, Tele Custom (modified), Lead III, Jag-Stang (ugh), Squier Super-Sonic
Horrible Washburn strat with one spring holding the bridge

Amps:
Fender Princeton 65, Orange Crush 15 (two hissy, noisy solidstate amps)

Keyboards:
Yamaha PSR-170, Casio SK-1

Effects:
Mu-Tron Wah (the Vol part is broken)
Clone of an Ampeg Scrambler (i forgot what his forum name was, here. nice guy)
Digitech PDS 1000, PDS 20/20
Electro Harmonix Small Stone
Voodoo Lab Bosstone
Zoom 5000 Hybrid Distortion, Ultra Fuzz, 3000 Multi-Unit (for Casio)
ProCo Rat2 mod by FXDoctor
DOD Juice Box, 585-B Dual Delay
Boss PS-2, FT-2, DC-3
Ibanez DE7, DML10, DML20, SS10, OT10 (which you recommended to me, did you not? i love it)

i usually run the OT10 and Ultra Fuzz on the Yamaha (set to Square Wave) to get dirty, murder tones.

hot_rats!

05.20.04, 7:14 PM

fiveways

05.20.04, 10:34 PM

Originally posted by cursivescript
which one, the DE7? i'm scared to open up the older ones. my rig... well, i'm not in a band and i rarely play outside of the house so i just change things all the time, but my inventory is:

Guitars:
Fender(s) Jazzmaster, Tele Custom (modified), Lead III, Jag-Stang (ugh), Squier Super-Sonic
Horrible Washburn strat with one spring holding the bridge

Amps:
Fender Princeton 65, Orange Crush 15 (two hissy, noisy solidstate amps)

Keyboards:
Yamaha PSR-170, Casio SK-1

Effects:
Mu-Tron Wah (the Vol part is broken)
Clone of an Ampeg Scrambler (i forgot what his forum name was, here. nice guy)
Digitech PDS 1000, PDS 20/20
Electro Harmonix Small Stone
Voodoo Lab Bosstone
Zoom 5000 Hybrid Distortion, Ultra Fuzz, 3000 Multi-Unit (for Casio)
ProCo Rat2 mod by FXDoctor
DOD Juice Box, 585-B Dual Delay
Boss PS-2, FT-2, DC-3
Ibanez DE7, DML10, DML20, SS10, OT10 (which you recommended to me, did you not? i love it)

i usually run the OT10 and Ultra Fuzz on the Yamaha (set to Square Wave) to get dirty, murder tones.

How is the 585-B?

And i did suggest the OT-10. Great stomper.

I want a could of the DML you have, I know that one of the later 10 series delays can get to 15 seconds, so I wanna pop them open and see what they really can do:)

Great low-fi delay rig. I'd add a reverb and a volume pedal and have massive '80s delay hell rig.

cursivescript

05.21.04, 7:26 AM

yeah, i love the SK-1. i misuse my Boss DC-3. since it's the only stereo output pedal i have, i use one of the outputs to go to the in-line sampler of my SK-1, so i can sample some short guitar tracks, and then end songs like a super lame whammy. it's so cheesy, but i love it.

the 585-B is really nice. the self-oscillation is kinda musical, but like most, it gets really loud. the delay itself has a little bit of a darker character, but not as dark as a Boss DM-2. on the cleanliness scale, i'd say it's inbetween a AD9 and a DM-2. but the dual function is cool. since you preset both times, when you hit the switch, the pitch either drops or rises. i like to put the DE-7 at near self-osc right after it, so when it switches it makes these beautiful pitch-bended delays. i have a hard time describing it, really. the downside is, with the power adapter, it is noisy. but with batteries, they don't last long. however, with already moderately used batteries, it does some really weird stuff that is awesome and i wish someone would make a delay with a low-battery simulator. i mean, it's really weird.

oh i think i understand why the DML's can get so long. it makes sense, because of the four (six on the 20) different time modes. rather than flanger, chorus, doubler, and echo, they would all probably end up as echo. maybe if i find another one, i'll try it. really, the only difference between a PDS 20/20 and a DML is the fact that the latter can't loop, but it's a lot smaller.

i've been searching for some good reverb. i read some of your sticky thread to get some ideas. i'm a little let down that the XP400 doesn't get good marks. on paper, it sounds like a reverb dream. the closest i use for reverb now is the DE7. and once i get some money, i want to try out that Ernie Ball Jr. it's a bit smaller and $30 cheaper.

fiveways

05.21.04, 12:26 PM

Originally posted by cursivescript
yeah, i love the SK-1. i misuse my Boss DC-3. since it's the only stereo output pedal i have, i use one of the outputs to go to the in-line sampler of my SK-1, so i can sample some short guitar tracks, and then end songs like a super lame whammy. it's so cheesy, but i love it.

I actually just got a SK-1, I will have to try that:)

the 585-B is really nice. the self-oscillation is kinda musical, but like most, it gets really loud. the delay itself has a little bit of a darker character, but not as dark as a Boss DM-2. on the cleanliness scale, i'd say it's inbetween a AD9 and a DM-2. but the dual function is cool. since you preset both times, when you hit the switch, the pitch either drops or rises. i like to put the DE-7 at near self-osc right after it, so when it switches it makes these beautiful pitch-bended delays. i have a hard time describing it, really. the downside is, with the power adapter, it is noisy. but with batteries, they don't last long. however, with already moderately used batteries, it does some really weird stuff that is awesome and i wish someone would make a delay with a low-battery simulator. i mean, it's really weird.

The weird pedal you want might be coming by way of a modifacation to a danelectro PB&J, and it has the dual mode stuff as well:)

The 585-b sounds awesome. I will have to look for one.

oh i think i understand why the DML's can get so long. it makes sense, because of the four (six on the 20) different time modes. rather than flanger, chorus, doubler, and echo, they would all probably end up as echo. maybe if i find another one, i'll try it. really, the only difference between a PDS 20/20 and a DML is the fact that the latter can't loop, but it's a lot smaller.

That is also what I figured. The DDL's from that series after teh DDL-10 all have holds, so you can loop with them. I need to get my hands on a few different ones to see what can be done. A whole new world of noisemakers awaits.

i've been searching for some good reverb. i read some of your sticky thread to get some ideas. i'm a little let down that the XP400 doesn't get good marks. on paper, it sounds like a reverb dream. the closest i use for reverb now is the DE7. and once i get some money, i want to try out that Ernie Ball Jr. it's a bit smaller and $30 cheaper.

The magic stomp is the best reverb in the universe for the cash. No joking.

I use a older rack, a Korg DRV-1000 a lot. It is awesome. Sound very dark, has a high-end cut, and a switch that takes it from your preset reverb to the longest amount. Very cool little function. The only issue with it is it is too big for use outside of the home.

What about a Zoom 507? They are cheap as hell and a not bad source of reverb....far better then the XP400, and you can hook a expression pedal up to them.

any

05.23.04, 7:30 AM

After tinkering with the pots on the 20/20 I was wondering if it's possible to put a momentary switch between the center pin and the outer pin of the internal trimpot that goes to a second trimpot with a lower value, this way you can let it self oscillate by stomping the switch and returning to normal when you release it. (kind of like the "warp" mode on the Boss DD-6)

Only problem I see is that the Pot is soldered to the PCB with 3 connections, or is the one attached to the metal plate a 'non functioning' connection to keep the pot in place? (the leg that's attached to the pot's 'metal plate')

What also crossed my mind is a low value pot (about 10k) between the delay time pot so you can 'fine tune' the delay time from the front because the 'sweep' on the pot is quite large. (there's room for one more pot between 'delay time' and 'regen'), it would also allow for more subtle pitchshifting... :)

Anyone have the know?

coldbuggin

05.24.04, 7:27 PM

i just looked through the harmony central review for this pedal and found this quote unbelievably funny:

"Horrible unable to set control for a single equal volume repeat. Unable to play "Cathedral" using this."

any

05.31.04, 11:38 AM

I've just installed a momentary footswitch on my 20/20 that set's oscillation to it's maximum setting when pressed.
I can now achieve self oscillation by pressing the switch.
It's definatly fun to have this extra future!

I'm going to try and install a capacitator to give it a bit of a ramp-up ramp-down effect. :D
(I actually don't know if that is possible...)

flipperbaby

06.15.04, 7:37 PM

Originally posted by any
I've just installed a momentary footswitch on my 20/20 that set's oscillation to it's maximum setting when pressed.
I can now achieve self oscillation by pressing the switch.
It's definatly fun to have this extra future!

I'm going to try and install a capacitator to give it a bit of a ramp-up ramp-down effect. :D
(I actually don't know if that is possible...)

can you PM me with how you did that or post here? thanks. :)

I tweaked mine for 18 seconds of delay with self oscillation.

any

06.16.04, 2:19 AM

Originally posted by flipperbaby
can you PM me with how you did that or post here? thanks. :)

I tweaked mine for 18 seconds of delay with self oscillation.

Just connect a momentary (NO=normally open) footswitch between the middle and outer lug of the regenertation pot.
(the lug the knob points towards when at maximum setting)
You can put a small capacitator between the switch and the lugs, but some caps will alter your tone (increase or decrease bass in repeats) but some can effectively cancel any 'popping' of the switch... expiriment! :)